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Toyota boss understands but doesn't condone JGR actions
By Bob Pockrass - Associate Editor
Tuesday, August 19, 2008
Toyota's top racing official says the manufacturer doesn't condone the actions by Joe Gibbs Racing employees who tried to manipulate NASCAR's horsepower test of Nationwide Series engines following Saturday's race at Michigan International Speedway.
Joe Gibbs Racing officials have said that no Toyota engineers were involved in the incident. The team is bracing for major penalties Tuesday after NASCAR discovered its employees rigged the throttle with magnets and spacers to keep it from producing maximum horsepower.
“I was pretty surprised to see what was happening and astonished and frankly incredulous,” Toyota Racing Development President Lee White said about the situation Sunday. “I couldn’t believe it was happening because it’s clearly defined in the entry forms that you don’t do this sort of thing.
“But I’m sure that [team owner] Joe and J.D. [Gibbs, team president] will take care of that internally, and whatever fans think they’re going to think, and we’re going to just keep working on our stuff.”
NASCAR had impounded engines after Nationwide races at Milwaukee and Chicagoland in the last two months to determine if the Toyota engine had a horsepower advantage. It implemented a rule in late July prior to the race in Indianapolis that forced the Toyotas to use a spacer that had smaller holes and allowed less air through the carburetor, cutting about 15 horsepower from those engines.
JGR had won 13 races up to that point and has won 14 of 25 events this year.
White said Toyota and its teams have been working to get that horsepower back. He said he could understand that JGR employees did not want the numbers to show how much they had gained when NASCAR took 10 cars to a chassis dynamometer, a typical occurrence after Michigan events in August.
“This sort of thing [in manipulating horsepower] is prevalent in the garage,” White said. “It’s not unknown. We had one of our truck [series] drivers ask us a couple of years ago, ‘Why aren’t you doing this because we always did it with our previous manufacturer?’
“I can understand because of the personal way a team would take the penalty that was without question directed toward them [at JGR], not the brand. They were penalized before Indy for overachievement.”
But while he understood it, he wouldn’t agree with the actions.
“It doesn’t condone it,” White said. “We don’t condone it. It’s not allowed in the rules.”
White said JGR remains in good standing with Toyota, and he was happy that J.D. Gibbs frankly addressed the issue Sunday at Michigan.
“We have seen instances throughout the last couple of years where teams were found to be doing things in postrace inspection which were obvious attempts to affect the performance of the car during the race,” White said. “To me, that is a blatant attempt to affect the outcome of the event. This was not an attempt to affect the outcome of the event.
“This was an attempt to somehow keep to themselves – in my opinion without even knowing what was actually done. It appears to be an attempt to keep their hands around some product of their effort and their hard work. And it wasn’t the right thing to do.”
It was clear that the entire horsepower issue and midseason rule change still rankled White.
“The basic change wasn’t warranted in the first place,” White said. “I was present when the restrictor was created between NASCAR and the manufacturers for the truck and the Nationwide series. The restrictor cuts the horsepower by 150 horsepower from the potential of the engines and 1,000 RPM. That limits the peak power for the Nationwide and the truck series.
“It isn’t a matter of engine design. It isn’t a matter of engine configuration. It’s a matter of who works on their product the hardest to optimize friction, combustion efficiency and fuel distribution. Those are really the only three areas you have to work on. I can even make the argument that since friction is such a big part of that, that having the tightest bore center and the Ford having the shortest and lightest crankshaft, it has the biggest advantage in Nationwide and trucks.”
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22 responses to "Toyota boss understands but doesn't condone JGR actions". Post a Comment.
Robert Wingert said:
Aug 18, 2008 at 4:45 PMBlah, Blah, Blah
Julie Seybert said:
Aug 18, 2008 at 4:49 PMdoes anyone think the drivers knew about this? always wondered about that when teams get caught?
otis gleason said:
Aug 18, 2008 at 4:53 PMI think we all understand. The right of one team to disclose Its secrets Should not be shown to thier competitors in the garage,By nascar Ford was never penilized for Roushs sucesses And when was Hendrick ever set back when they had the year they had last year.I think nascar Entering dangerious territory here setting presumptuous rules.
Ted Kamieniecki said:
Aug 18, 2008 at 7:23 PMI suppose all the other teams party all week long, and all the Toyota people work 24/7. Glad to see the true colors of the rising sun are coming out. Hope the crew chiefs get suspended and both the owner and drivers get points deducted.
Ted Kamieniecki said:
Aug 18, 2008 at 7:24 PMI suppose all the other teams party all week long, and all the Toyota people work 24/7. Glad to see the true colors of the rising sun are coming out. Hope the crew chiefs get suspended and both the owner and drivers get points deducted.
Richard Bennett said:
Aug 18, 2008 at 7:38 PMI don't belive Toyota did not know about this blatant attempt to hide thier true perfomance numbers, hopeing Nascar would give them more perfofmance advantages. It is pretty sorry of Toyota to use JGR as thier scapegoats.
George Rice said:
Aug 18, 2008 at 8:42 PMLee White and the Gibbs bunch are paying NASCAR a large fortune to cover the 50 HP advantage that was given them over the off season. So now they have to cheat to cover the DYNO test. Are they are useing aviation fuel like Miachel Waltrip chetaed with. Gibbs say it isn't so. Tony and Chevy forever
George Rice said:
Aug 18, 2008 at 8:51 PMGibbs and Toyota are crying all the way to the bank. Mr. Gibbs you at one time was above this. To go from Miachel Waltrip who could not even qualify to a 50 Horsepower advantage is huge. What a way to ruin it all NASCAR. Go Tony S. and CHEVY.
Marty Harkins said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 12:58 AMInstead of taking points and a fine, Nascar should mandate that the #20 and #18 Nationwise Series cars compete the rest of the season with the magnets installed on the accelerator pedals.
ed blake said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 8:56 AMwhat Marty said
mike simpson said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 9:49 AMTHE BIGEST THING IS ALL THE OTHER OWNERS HAS CRYED SO MUCH THAT NASCAR HAD TO DO SOMETHING. BUT AGAIN NASCAR DID IT WRONG AGAIN. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE CHILDRES AND ROUCHS HP AFTER THE RACE THEY NEED TO SEE IF SOME MAGNETS AREN'T USED.BUT ALL THEY CAN DO IS CRY. GO TONY
otis gleason said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 11:02 AMGeorge Rice 50HP?.We are not talking cup here,This is Nationwide series.Where did you get that number? Let me educate you,The first test Toyota 634 Chev 624 Ford was 625 Dodge 628 Now with correction factor that gave 10-12 hp advantage to toyota over the chev Now the toyota that produced 634 came from the 99MWR car not gibbs,And the chev from the rcr of bowyer that is still running SB2 engine,When NASCAR gives them RO7 They will need magnets!
otis gleason said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 11:03 AMGeorge Rice 50HP?.We are not talking cup here,This is Nationwide series.Where did you get that number? Let me educate you,The first test Toyota 634 Chev 624 Ford was 625 Dodge 628 Now with correction factor that gave 10-12 hp advantage to toyota over the chev Now the toyota that produced 634 came from the 99MWR car not gibbs,And the chev from the rcr of bowyer that is still running SB2 engine,When NASCAR gives them RO7 They will need magnets!
Marine Corps Veteran said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 12:37 PMWe are talking about plausable deniability. What is this garbage from the toyota cheaters? That the boss didnt know his employees where cheating? Does not make sense and is completely unbelieveable. Toyota is not the victim of employees who cheated... it ordered them to cheat.
Worm Dirt said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 1:38 PMAlright Marine Core Vet.... Are you kidding??? Let me ask you this.... Of the TWO options here.....1)that there was "plausible deniablity" and that evil Toyota "ordered them to cheat".....AND.....2)that some employees made a stupid decision on their own and neither Gibbs nor Toyota had ANY idea about it. Of the two options, where are your FACTS to back up "plausible deniability"? Just sounds like MORE disgruntled pessimistic naysaying to me. Is your hatred for Toyota really so strong that you will compromise your own dignity and spread lies with NO FACTS to back them up. Nice attitude man! Good luck with that.....
Glenn Heard said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 3:52 PMTo Otis Gleason et al....How do we know that when the dyno tests were done, previously, that the 10 to 12 hp difference was accurate? Could JGR (Toyota) have been using the magnets (spacers) in prior tests?
Doug Webster said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 5:59 PMLee White understands cheating, he just doesn't condone getting caught.I am sure he understood why Waltrip used jet fuel last year, but didn't condone him getting caught. Bill Davis must have told him he would not cheat for him, look what happened to him. Gibb's Racing stood tall and raised their hand, "pick me, pick me" Why do you think the IRL is in such a disarray now? #1 answer TOYOTA!
Robert Wingert said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 7:05 PMGreat question Glenn. Those magnets seem to be standard equipment for Toyota Dyno testing. They could have been placed there after every race not knowing when they would be tested. The only thing missing on the Toyota's is the Japanese Zero. Please don't anyone insult a Marine Core Vet. Nascar the American Sport.
patricia jordan said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 9:14 PMi dont care who was at fault but i dont think that one team should be allowed more of any thing than the other it makes for boring races that fans spend there hard earned money to see. be it gibbs hendrick rousch or whoever one or two winners every time is boring ,,,,
Adam Argabright said:
Aug 19, 2008 at 11:33 PMI'd like to see the whole team suspended for a few weeks in the Nationwide and Sprint Cup Series. That would nullify and success gained by an illegal advantage that they were obviously trying to cover up, and it would set an example by NASCAR to show that these kinds of things will absolutely not be tolerated. I bet after seeing all of the JGR cars parked for three weeks or so, no team would even consider trying to do the same thing again.
Worm Dirt said:
Aug 20, 2008 at 1:27 AMI actually think this whole thing is BACKWARDS.... Maybe JGR should fine Nascar for changing the rules and "CHEATING" THEM out of the horsepower they aquired BY FOLLOWING THE NASCARS RULES!!!!! As all of you naysayers unite in your HATRED for Toyota, have you ever even stopped to consider the principle involved here??? Despite the FACT that JGR found its horsepower within Nascar's OWN RULES, Nascar still handicapped them to level the playing field. It's the equivalent of the chinese government making Michael Phelps swim with one-arm tied behind his back because he's too fast!!! Is this how you want your races decided???? What's next.....are they going to GIVE horsepower to the manufacturers with the lower horsepower numbers after the dyno tests?
Green Marion said:
Aug 20, 2008 at 8:19 PMI have to comment on Mr. Gleason's comment that Roush was never penilized for his success. A few years back Roush placed all five of his cars in the top ten at Las Vegas and Ford was penilized for the rest of the year. I've been a NASCAR fan dating back into the 50's. Everything was good until Brian France came onto the scene. Until he's put out to pasture look for the sport to nose-dive.